Index Archive 1

This page has archives. Topics inactive for 90 days are automatically archived by ClueBot III if there are more than 4.

Ready to Harvest is a youtuber with a NPOV who has criticised the graph in this video. I think we have to recognize the inherent oversimplification and other problems a graphical representation create. I still think we have to keep a representation as a summary. So I would not be in favour of taking the graph out without a better replacement. 2A02:1810:BCA9:3A00:D559:D71:6115:83A (talk) 20:11, 4 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

To summarize: his main critique of the Wikipedia timeline was on the "gray line" of early Christianity. The chart shows that the Councils of Ephesus and Chalcedon resulted in new, separate denominations while the old Christianity continued, but the Great Schism resulted in a terminus to early Christianity and the equal split of Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Why the difference? The chart does not explain why these moments are treated differently. At best it is missing info about the different natures of these events, at worst it is theologically motivated (i.e. they aren't "real" Christianity). He also had critiques of other timelines, but they are not applicable to the Wikipedia timeline. -Thunderforge (talk) 18:04, 5 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

He misunderstands that the chart is only a schematic diagram (like the famous London subway map) and assigns value to features in the chart that exist purely for practical reasons. Just like the London subway map doesn't display geographical distances, this map doesn't show denomination sizes, priorities or theological distances exactly. Rmhermen (talk) 05:50, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think the Youtuber is right on some points:

• the separations between Ephesian Christianity and the Church of the East should be shown as a fork
• After the council of Ephesus, the line should be named Ephesian Christianity
• the separations between Chalcedonian Christianity and the Oriental Orthodox Churches should be shown as a fork
• after the council of Chalcedon, the line should be named Chalcedonian Christianity

Doing the same thing with the Protestant lines would, I think, make the diagram too cluttered. Also, this would mean that there would be a radical change of the Catholic Church at the time which would warrant a new name to it, but there is none. Veverve (talk) 12:38, 4 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Given the descriptor "Major denominational families", I think the branch names can be shortened for clarity and accuracy.

I suggest dropping the "ism" suffix from all protestant branches. It's "the Anglican family", not "the Anglicanism family." The sideways term "Protestantism" can be shortened to "Protestant" as well, and "Protestant Reformation" to just "Reformation" for purposes of the chart. I would like to see some reference to the catholic reformation as well as the protestant, but I don't see an easy way to convey that.

"Catholic Church" should be just shortened to "Catholic." Even though "The Catholic Church" is an entity comprised of many constituent churches, there are parts of this branch not in communion with Rome, yet still validly referred to as non protestant "catholic". See Old Catholic Church and Independent Catholicism.

"Eastern Orthodox Church" and "Oriental Orthodox Church" should drop the "church" for the same reasoning.

With this change, I suggest dropping the confusing "full communion" identifier. Intercommunion has to do with the organized, ecclesiastical entity, not the tradition. There are subsets within these traditions that are not part of the communion arrangement. Furthermore, it seems arbitrary to highlight communion between the Oriental Orthodox tradition with the Catholic and not between Lutheran with Calvinist, for example. Dirkwillems (talk) 01:23, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You chart shows the Catholic Church doesn’t come into existence until the 11 century. Bruh 2600:6C56:6500:985:7CF2:BDF9:3123:1859 (talk) 07:22, 20 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This isn't Reddit. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 07:25, 20 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What do the dashed lines mean, and is "full communion" referencing the line above or below it? Is there perhaps a better/clearer way to illustrate this? Does this need a key? Criticalthinker (talk) 13:01, 11 August 2025 (UTC)[reply]